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Post by aceplace57 on Mar 17, 2009 15:11:04 GMT -5
Wow, Sarah can be one cruel witch. Her treatment of Cameron is often deplorable. She has to realize that A.I.'s learn from their experiences. You kick a dog every day and eventually it will try to rip your throat out. Sarah just keeps on kicking Cameron at every opportunity. The wiki mentioned a Canadian preview that showed John with a gun confronting Jesse and asking if she knew who he was. terminatorwiki.fox.com/thread/2564540/Episode+19+Preview+(Canadian+Version)So far, I haven't seen it posted anywhere.
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Post by gothamite66 on Mar 17, 2009 15:21:39 GMT -5
I think Sarah's trying to keep Cameron away from John right at that moment. So she may be saying some mean stuff but Sarah doesn't trust Cameron and Cameron is heading out the door to John with one hand twitching and the other holding a gun.
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t101
Major
Posts: 716
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Post by t101 on Mar 17, 2009 15:58:49 GMT -5
What Sarah's trying to imply doesn't make much sense. John didn't want Cameron around... so he sent her "away" to protect himself at the vulnerable age of 16 when his personality is just forming and when they possibly have the next 20 years to spend together. This changes what? Not to mention he'd just destroy her.
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sgs
Refugee
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Post by sgs on Mar 17, 2009 16:46:49 GMT -5
I posted this on the FOX board: Here I am again. I just saw the Canadian preview for episode 20: Today is the Day, Part 2 on Canadian television station SPACE. Here's what I remember, and once again, I don't have video capturing technology, and no I don't sit around with my digital camera on the video record feature waiting for the commercial to come around ... Anyways, here's what I saw: - John asking Derek, "What do people think of me in the future?" -- they are either in the house or in Jesse's hotel room - John sitting the same chair that Jesse was sitting in at the end of the last episode in her hotel room. He has a gun in his hand, sitting back and says to Jesse "Don't pretend you don't know who I am", to which Jesse responds, "You're John Connor" - Derek answers John question, saying "Humanity rises or falls on your shoulders" - In slow motion, Derek points a gun and then the picture cuts to Jesse running in slow motion up some stairs and then aclose up on someone pulling the trigger to a gun. All three images may or may not be related. There are also a couple of shots of the box and the sub crew, but you don't see the box open or what comes out, but you hear Jesse say that "hell came out". That's all I remember, but I think that's quite a bit, huh? Discuss.
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Post by aceplace57 on Mar 17, 2009 17:17:51 GMT -5
Well, it sounds like John finally found his bollocks. Honestly, I'm gobsmacked. ;D
Instead of crying and blaming Cameron, John did some investigating. He looked at Riley's bruised knuckles, the skin under her fingernails etc. and figured out Cameron didn't do it. I'm looking forward to seeing how John learns about Jesse.
Jesse may not make it through this episode alive. Josh may kill off a character in every episode. That'll get the ratings up.
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Post by vicheron on Mar 17, 2009 17:49:07 GMT -5
But we don't know if Cromartie was programmed to never go against Skynet's plans. All we know is that he's programmed to kill John Connor and he didn't go against that directive. In fact, it actually shows just how effective Skynet's programming is. Cromartie wasn't able to think for himself at all. He was programmed to kill John Connor and he couldn't go against that programming even if it meant interfering in Skynet's other plans. Except that Cromartie did disable the Ellison Terminator that SkyNet sent back to kill Ellison, since Cromartie still saw value in Ellison. So that directly crossed and negated one of SkyNet's own orders - terminate Mr. Ellison. Thats a judgement call Cromartie made all by himself, just one of many actually. Thats what made him dengerous. However, this thread isn't about Cromartie... so... Except that Skynet didn't actually reprogram Cromartie with new orders. Cromartie would have had to use his reasoning skills to change his own programming to follow Skynet's new orders and remember what Kyle Reese said about Terminators, "It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead." Cromartie couldn't change his own programming and he couldn't change Terminator Ellison's programming either. That's why he didn't try to talk with Terminator Ellison. But they still have to follow what has been established. You're the one who started this deviation by arguing against my idea that the rogue Terminator faction was formed by Terminators reprogrammed by the Resistance. We know that the Resistance has trouble controlling Terminators and we've even seen reprogrammed Terminators go bad. You keep talking about how there's always a chance that Skynet's Terminators may turn but from what we've seen, there's a far greater chance of a Resistance Terminator going rogue and the Resistance will be less able to hunt down and destroy rogue Terminators. If the rogue Terminator faction was formed by Terminators reprogrammed by the Resistance, it would certainly explain why they would want both peace and John Connor dead. They would also have one advantage that Skynet doesn't have, they would know what John Connor looks like, that means they can create Terminators that look like John Connor. That's valuable information they can use to bargain with both Skynet and the Resistance. It would also explain why John Connor would actually agree to open the box himself since he wouldn't risk giving his identity away because the rogue Terminators already know what he looks like.
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Post by VALIANT CHAMPION on Mar 17, 2009 18:52:47 GMT -5
What will John do if he realizes that Jesse killed Riley? If he was going to disable Cameron (whom he cares about), what would he do to someone he doesn't even know?
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Post by Hollow Crown on Mar 17, 2009 22:11:01 GMT -5
After seeing this new clip, I am convinced that Cameron will be the one leaving John, not betraying him.
I think Sarah will betray John, but not in the sense that it ruins their relationship forever.
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Post by aceplace57 on Mar 17, 2009 22:22:36 GMT -5
I'm beginning to think Sarah does something to Cameron. That would be a betrayal in John's eyes. Sarah would push the button on that explosive trigger in a New York minute.
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Post by samuel95 on Mar 17, 2009 22:41:31 GMT -5
What will John do if he realizes that Jesse killed Riley? If he was going to disable Cameron (whom he cares about), what would he do to someone he doesn't even know? And what would Derek do if he found out first? What would Derek do if he knew John was already resolving the issue? What will Cameron do when she inevitably finds out? I think it's a fairly good bet that Jesse is doomed. How it all plays out will be a good show. I don't think there's a way for the writers to screw it up with all the pieces set up like they are. Or to put it more positively, the writers have set this up brilliantly and we should expect it to play out that way as well.
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Post by thecolours on Mar 17, 2009 23:10:53 GMT -5
What Sarah's trying to imply doesn't make much sense. John didn't want Cameron around... so he sent her "away" to protect himself at the vulnerable age of 16 when his personality is just forming and when they possibly have the next 20 years to spend together. This changes what? Not to mention he'd just destroy her. I think Sarah said all this, because she is bitter that John sent Cameron back to essentially replace her. She doesn't want Cameron to go help John, because that's her job. She's jealous. Her emotions are getting the best of her, and it showed during her irrationally outburst.
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Post by allergygal on Mar 18, 2009 1:04:24 GMT -5
What Sarah's trying to imply doesn't make much sense. John didn't want Cameron around... so he sent her "away" to protect himself at the vulnerable age of 16 when his personality is just forming and when they possibly have the next 20 years to spend together. This changes what? Not to mention he'd just destroy her. I agree. It wouldn't make sense at all for future!John to send Cameron back to his younger self as a way of getting rid of her. If Sarah's guessing correctly on future!John's motive, then maybe he did it assuming his mom would destroy Cameron after she'd served her purpose. Probably what's really going on in that scene, though, is Sarah sort of countering that little discussion Cameron had with her about John being better off alone. I think Sarah's trying to put Cameron in the same position of wondering whether or not John would be better off without her.
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Alexis
Private
Winter 09 Episode Wallpaper Challenge Winner
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Post by Alexis on Mar 18, 2009 1:10:57 GMT -5
- John asking Derek, "What do people think of me in the future?" -- they are either in the house or in Jesse's hotel room - John sitting the same chair that Jesse was sitting in at the end of the last episode in her hotel room. He has a gun in his hand, sitting back and says to Jesse "Don't pretend you don't know who I am", to which Jesse responds, "You're John Connor" - Derek answers John question, saying "Humanity rises or falls on your shoulders" - In slow motion, Derek points a gun and then the picture cuts to Jesse running in slow motion up some stairs and then aclose up on someone pulling the trigger to a gun. All three images may or may not be related. OMFG!! Taking into account that Stephanie Jacobsen's name didn't appear on the list of the episodes that follows Today Is The Day Pt. 2, I'd dare to say this might be the last time we'll see Jesse Flores alive. I think Derek needs to pull the trigger. As I said before, Derek needs to kill Jesse in order to be redeemed as a character and as a condition to get any possible further development. Yep, I want him to kill Jesse. That would be almost poetic - In my own twisted conception of "poetic", of course. ;D
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Post by littleb on Mar 18, 2009 2:45:50 GMT -5
Wow, Sarah can be one cruel witch. Her treatment of Cameron is often deplorable. I love her. I love it when she's being a mean-ass. ;D Sarah doesn't trust or like metal. I guess she's had its hands around her throat too many times. Makes a person uneasy. She's always had a very on-off relationship with Cameron. She tolerates Cam because she knows John needs the protection, but at the moment she's certainly not trusting her (and probably never has.) In the clip, Cameron says about the police IDing Riley's body "I need to be with him if they do." Why? She sounds like she means for emotional support and that's totally not why she's around. She lists why she's around; "Protect John, hunt Skynet. Stop Judgement Day." At no point does the mission include providing a shoulder to cry on. That should be Sarah's role so the conflict between the two is always going to be there. Cam's given Sarah too many reasons not to trust her: the spare parts, the secret night-time flits, Riley, Cam's influence over John, the twitching, oh and there was that point where Cam went all murderous and tried to kill her and her son - I don't think Sarah's going out on a limb being a little wary of her. Cameron's not a pet. She's incredibly dangerous (which makes Sarah possibly a little suicidal for provoking her) and - as evidenced by the twitching - not entirely reliable. If we're going with the pet analogy, Sarah's probably thinking along the lines of: it's time to put the pooch down, especially if Cameron's still number one on the list of Riley murderers during that scene. Meanwhile with Allergygal... I never even thought about it the way Sarah is. The obvious answer though is that Future!John trusted Cameron above all else and knew she was the best terminator for the job. That would make more sense, because Sarah's theory doesn't really. Thematically, the show has been building to a confrontation between these two for quite a while now - SMW was a big ol' clue. I wonder whether the "betrayal" is actually going to be Cameron going after Sarah. That twitching seems to be opening up a possessiveness towards John that can't be good news. Who knows, the police station rampage might be a hunt, not a rescue... (and if so, I am totally on board with that!)
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Post by allergygal on Mar 18, 2009 4:31:56 GMT -5
Wow, Sarah can be one cruel witch. Her treatment of Cameron is often deplorable. I love her. I love it when she's being a mean-ass. ;D Sarah doesn't trust or like metal. I guess she's had its hands around her throat too many times. Makes a person uneasy. She's always had a very on-off relationship with Cameron. She tolerates Cam because she knows John needs the protection, but at the moment she's certainly not trusting her (and probably never has.) In the clip, Cameron says about the police IDing Riley's body "I need to be with him if they do." Why? She sounds like she means for emotional support and that's totally not why she's around. She lists why she's around; "Protect John, hunt Skynet. Stop Judgement Day." At no point does the mission include providing a shoulder to cry on. That should be Sarah's role so the conflict between the two is always going to be there. Cam's given Sarah too many reasons not to trust her: the spare parts, the secret night-time flits, Riley, Cam's influence over John, the twitching, oh and there was that point where Cam went all murderous and tried to kill her and her son - I don't think Sarah's going out on a limb being a little wary of her. Cameron's not a pet. She's incredibly dangerous (which makes Sarah possibly a little suicidal for provoking her) and - as evidenced by the twitching - not entirely reliable. If we're going with the pet analogy, Sarah's probably thinking along the lines of: it's time to put the pooch down, especially if Cameron's still number one on the list of Riley murderers during that scene. I'm with you on all that. Those machines sure do like to go for Sarah's throat, don't they? And of course try to get her to call to John... silly robots. ;D I'm with you. Not only is Cameron secretive, deceptive and becoming more and more unpredictable, she seems to have a potentially dangerous emotional hold on John. Cameron is still a powerful weapon to have around, but if you can't rely on her, what good is she? Her risks are beginning to outweigh her benefits. Which takes us back to question Sarah posed in the second episode of the season: "What do you do with a guard dog you can't trust?" Meanwhile with Allergygal... That would make more sense, because Sarah's theory doesn't really. Thematically, the show has been building to a confrontation between these two for quite a while now - SMW was a big ol' clue. I wonder whether the "betrayal" is actually going to be Cameron going after Sarah. That twitching seems to be opening up a possessiveness towards John that can't be good news. Who knows, the police station rampage might be a hunt, not a rescue... (and if so, I am totally on board with that!) Hmm - police station as a hunt and not a rescue is an interseting possibility. I hadn't even considered that. I guess it depends on if that happens before or after the water delivery terminator because Sarah and Cameron appear to be working together in that. Ah, but I believe Cameron gets electrocuted in that battle. So, she could restart and be all glitched again and going after Sarah for some reason. Then Sarah ends up in jail and Cam comes-a-huntin'. But why go after Sarah? I've no guesses. I have an alternate wacky theory about Cameron going after Sarah: If the kill switch Cameron gave to John is real and if she firmly believes that John needs to be alone, Cameron might plan to kill Sarah knowing it would prompt John to press the button. That would take them both out, leaving John alone. If that is her plan, though, it's obviously not going to work. And then there's the simple theory (and probably more likely theory): Sarah's going to leave (because she's a fugitive and machines are hunting her since Skynet knows she's in 2008 LA) and Cameron is going to betray John. The only betrayal I can come up with, though, is that the kill switch is fake. But even so, I have no guesses as to what Cameron does to initiate John wanting to press that button in the first place. Maybe Cameron kills Charley? Could that be Cameron shooting at them while they're running through the sand?
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