k8ie
Corporal
Posts: 1,482
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Post by k8ie on Nov 28, 2008 13:36:39 GMT -5
I'm not sure how hard I want to argue the point myself, t101, but as someone pointed out in another thread... somewhere, Jesse's only working a long con from our perspective. From the future POV, she can take all the time she wants and still effect instantaneous change. As for shooting John in the head... well, it could be that the normal rules no longer apply, eh? Jesse could still be a terminator but one who's mission is to ensure that certain events don't happen or happen as they happened "in the past" - what if John Connor's life is as essential to Skynet's apotheosis as Skynet's existence is to John Connor's conception? One thing is certain: Jesse must die.
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Post by Derek Reese on Dec 5, 2008 1:04:00 GMT -5
Thus far I can't say I'm buying she's a Terminator theory. She reads more like a Resistance Fighter, that was part of a unit gathered together, unknown to even Connor's eyes to resolve matters as they see fit, which in this case maybe taking out John Connor entirely for some out there reason, that has yet to be explained as of yet. But its not uncommon for mutiny within the ranks of a military or the like.
I could see Jesse easily following orders to a point and seeing the war not going well, so she joins a group that is put forth to try and change things. They could believe in the idea of Connor saving human to a point and then lose faith in the idea, seeing the war continue and in order to do as such go into the past to correct the error in their own fashion.
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Post by allergygal on Dec 5, 2008 2:21:18 GMT -5
Thus far I can't say I'm buying she's a Terminator theory. She reads more like a Resistance Fighter, that was part of a unit gathered together, unknown to even Connor's eyes to resolve matters as they see fit, which in this case maybe taking out John Connor entirely for some out there reason, that has yet to be explained as of yet. But its not uncommon for mutiny within the ranks of a military or the like. I could see Jesse easily following orders to a point and seeing the war not going well, so she joins a group that is put forth to try and change things. They could believe in the idea of Connor saving human to a point and then lose faith in the idea, seeing the war continue and in order to do as such go into the past to correct the error in their own fashion. I'm still holding to this theory as well. Until I see see anything to the contrary, I think Jesse's part of an anti-John Connor faction. They don't want him dead or anything — they love him as much as everyone else in future war. But where they split from Connor is in his use of the metal. I think it's just that issue that creates the split in the resistance. How she intends to manipulate that from present day, I'm not sure. I do think there's some truth to what she told Derek. But I don't think it's as simple and pure as wanting to "save" John from the metal. It's probably part of a larger power grab — positioning her group better to take over as soon as John gets the resistance going. Or I could be totally wrong and she's just a terminator with a fake scar who's waiting for the right moment to strike ;D
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Post by aceplace57 on Dec 5, 2008 12:49:51 GMT -5
I was suspicious of Jesse from the start. Jesse showed Derek a large shrapnel wound mostly healed and scarred. The dialogue was... Derek: That's New Jesse: Not to me There's metal everywhere these days. Looking for us, Working for us. Connor's got at least one at every major base. By the end of the episode the wound was smaller and less scarring. Yet only a few days passed. A Fx mistake or did Jesse heal quickly because she's a Cyborg? Judge for yourself The scar also swaps sides. Originally on her right and later the left. A shooting goof that we can ignore.
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Post by allergygal on Dec 5, 2008 14:52:04 GMT -5
If Jesse is a cyborg but the scar was real, it would have already healed by now. So if there's a difference in her scar from one scene to another, I'd say it's just continuity (there's no way to get something like that *exactly* the same every time).
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Post by aceplace57 on Dec 5, 2008 16:14:36 GMT -5
Jesse last scene in Tower is Tall is kind of weird. She's by herself and pulls up the shirt to check out the wound in the mirror. She seems very pleased that the wound/scar was nearly gone. I thought it was odd because she had shown it to Derek just days earlier and it was inflamed & looked infected.
Maybe it's nothing. But, Jesse had a very cocky, pleased attitude in that scene. She knew her plans were working out. She had hooked Derek and sprung the trap.
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Post by allergygal on Dec 5, 2008 16:55:48 GMT -5
Yeah but considering Derek's been sleeping there with her, I think he'd have noticed by now if the scar was healing.
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Post by richardstevenhack on Dec 6, 2008 3:09:42 GMT -5
It makes no sense that Jesse would be a Terminator while spouting all sorts of anti-metal propaganda. Even if you assume she was only doing this to make her sound more human, it's still overkill.
Also, there's no way you can have sex with a Terminator - I mean REAL sex, not just fooling around or oral or whatever) - and not know simply by the weight. Unless we're assuming these female versions have an alloy that matches human bone and flesh weight - which is highly unlikely.
Derek WOULD know, folks.
No, Jesse is entirely human. And from the clip I saw today of Monday's episode, we also know where Riley's phrase about "apples" comes from - Australia. She got it from Jesse! And Jesse's from Australia (in the future).
There's no doubt that she's a severe metal hater AND very likely from a section of the Resistance that isn't directly under the command of John Connor, i.e., from another country. We don't know how the Resistance is organized world-wide because that's never been addressed in the franchise or the series. All we've seen is the LA area Resistance where Connor appears to have his HQ.
That leads directly to her being likely to be someone who's out to oust Connor from command of the Resistance altogether. Why she's using Riley is presumably to wean present John from Cameron, but beyond that I suspect she has further plans for present John to either manipulate him or eliminate him as head of the Resistance.
Either way, she's going to go up against Derek and/or John at some point - if she's lucky. If she's not, she'll go up against Cameron - and that will be instant death, regardless of how Derek or John feel about it. The instant Cameron finds out about Jesse and that she is a threat to her or John, Jesse is dead meat.
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t101
Major
Posts: 716
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Post by t101 on Dec 6, 2008 3:18:18 GMT -5
First. No way Jesse is a terminator. But:
Barbara in Vic's chip did not know. And according to the writers their terminators are only slightly more heavy than humans.
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Post by chrisimo on Dec 6, 2008 6:00:04 GMT -5
Also, there's no way you can have sex with a Terminator - I mean REAL sex, not just fooling around or oral or whatever) - and not know simply by the weight. Unless we're assuming these female versions have an alloy that matches human bone and flesh weight - which is highly unlikely. This is a quote from Zack Stents: bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=127803
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Post by Derek Reese on Dec 9, 2008 15:54:15 GMT -5
It makes no sense that Jesse would be a Terminator while spouting all sorts of anti-metal propaganda. Even if you assume she was only doing this to make her sound more human, it's still overkill. Also, there's no way you can have sex with a Terminator - I mean REAL sex, not just fooling around or oral or whatever) - and not know simply by the weight. Unless we're assuming these female versions have an alloy that matches human bone and flesh weight - which is highly unlikely. Derek WOULD know, folks. No, Jesse is entirely human. And from the clip I saw today of Monday's episode, we also know where Riley's phrase about "apples" comes from - Australia. She got it from Jesse! And Jesse's from Australia (in the future). There's no doubt that she's a severe metal hater AND very likely from a section of the Resistance that isn't directly under the command of John Connor, i.e., from another country. We don't know how the Resistance is organized world-wide because that's never been addressed in the franchise or the series. All we've seen is the LA area Resistance where Connor appears to have his HQ. That leads directly to her being likely to be someone who's out to oust Connor from command of the Resistance altogether. Why she's using Riley is presumably to wean present John from Cameron, but beyond that I suspect she has further plans for present John to either manipulate him or eliminate him as head of the Resistance. Either way, she's going to go up against Derek and/or John at some point - if she's lucky. If she's not, she'll go up against Cameron - and that will be instant death, regardless of how Derek or John feel about it. The instant Cameron finds out about Jesse and that she is a threat to her or John, Jesse is dead meat. Well said and I'm in total agreement.
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timstuff
Private
Scary robot? Naw...
Posts: 232
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Post by timstuff on Dec 9, 2008 16:45:59 GMT -5
Also, there's no way you can have sex with a Terminator - I mean REAL sex, not just fooling around or oral or whatever) - and not know simply by the weight. Unless we're assuming these female versions have an alloy that matches human bone and flesh weight - which is highly unlikely. This is a quote from Zack Stents: bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=127803Excellent points. The whole "terminators weigh half a ton" nonsense is just that, and it irritates me at just how often it seems to come up. Uncle Bob would have flattened his Harley if what some people claim about Terminators' weight is true.
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t101
Major
Posts: 716
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Post by t101 on Dec 9, 2008 17:59:58 GMT -5
Well, now there should be zero doubt that Jesse is not a terminator. She got infected with a virus, examined by doctors, and healed with a vaccine.
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Post by Derek Reese on Dec 9, 2008 18:14:53 GMT -5
Well, now there should be zero doubt that Jesse is not a terminator. She got infected with a virus, examined by doctors, and healed with a vaccine. Another valid point.
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Post by aceplace57 on Dec 9, 2008 18:25:31 GMT -5
quote "Otherwise you could just stand them on scales or put breakaway flooring at the front entrances to resistance bunkers! " I'd like to see Derek check Jesse with a thermal camera. I agree Jesse is probably human, but I bet a Terminator could pass too. They'd be too easy to spot if they didn't have a thermal pattern. Just like being too heavy. Well, now there should be zero doubt that Jesse is not a terminator. She got infected with a virus, examined by doctors, and healed with a vaccine. nice try. ;D That was future Jesse. Something else may have time jumped. It seems more and more likely that the writers introduced an evil human (Jesse) to remind us that the future human race isn't singing Kum Ba Yah. Humans will always lie, steal and kill. They'll never totally unite to fight anything.
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