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Post by chrisimo on Nov 7, 2008 2:13:28 GMT -5
Interesting setup there Tom. However it happens - whatever happens from it, we know Cameron ends up on his bed. That much is a given. (I like happy endings too) Chrisimo: Its a wild guess, but perhaps thats exactly what she's doing in that scene? Maybe she's learning from that suicide brochure, and taking the initiative to spend some time to just be with him? like a friend would? Subtlety gain his trust back in that manner of just being around him like that. If thats the case, I think Cameron's off to a good start. Cameron at this point is the only one John can unload onto. Yes, I think it would have the best chance of success. She tried to comfort him in the pilot ('In the future you have many friends') so if she does more things like that she may gain his trust again. Of course this would take some time.
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Post by terrasj on Nov 7, 2008 4:16:33 GMT -5
Yes, I think it would have the best chance of success. She tried to comfort him in the pilot ('In the future you have many friends') so if she does more things like that she may gain his trust again. Of course this would take some time. When written properly, it surely does. That'll be good character development for both. And thats what we'll be tuning in for. I could've sworn she repeated that exact line in that clip laying on John's bed. It was a short and fast clip, so I could be wrong. If someone has it recorded and proves otherwise, then freely correct me
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tom
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Post by tom on Nov 7, 2008 12:55:57 GMT -5
I think she said "Being John Connor can be lonely" It would match the bed scene's mood. Call me crazy, /it's totally against my instincts/ but I kinda hope nothing happens on that bed. It would mess things up even more. I just want them to be- shall I say 'friends' again. And if John could trust Cameron again, it could also affect his relationship with Sarah. Summer said Cameron tries to make it up with John later in this season, but she didn't say when and will it be successful. Let's hope.
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Post by terrasj on Nov 7, 2008 13:57:26 GMT -5
I think she said "Being John Connor can be lonely" It would match the bed scene's mood. Call me crazy, /it's totally against my instincts/ but I kinda hope nothing happens on that bed. It would mess things up even more. I just want them to be- shall I say 'friends' again. And if John could trust Cameron again, it could also affect his relationship with Sarah. Summer said Cameron tries to make it up with John later in this season, but she didn't say when and will it be successful. Let's hope. I don't blame you there - that would be / feel / seem a cheap and forced cop-out to solve an issue. (much like how Riley was brought in). Oh yeah, Cameron just throws her sex-appeal onto John, and John totally goes for it on the spot, and we see a John/Cam feverish hormone filled lusty romp. As much as I would like to see that kind of probability happen much later in the series, but just not here, not now, this moment, out of the blue. It would break the credibility of both characters. "Being John Connor can be lonely" And "lonely" is a dual edged term. It can imply loneliness from lack of friends, as well as lack of having a lover. It can mean one, either or both. Thats how and where this scene comes in as the hint and start of mending their friendship. And over time it can ( could but not necessarily) hint to become something more - with subtle little looks and shared moments of a few seconds length between them every now and then. This already played really well in the first season, keeping it really subtle with the hints and clues. Oh the other hand, it wouldn't break Riley's character to pull that on John, pulling something like that just on impulse if the timing and location is right (no Sarah or Cameron or Derek around. Alone together late at night in the house, watching tv). And lastly, we don't even know when this scene takes place. It would seem to make the most sense at the end of the episode, if Riley gets killed or something traumatizes John. Or maybe its just a wind-down scene, from all the heat & action, as well as Cameron helping John wind down from the day's events (lets not go to the gutter with this one). I mean more along the lines of Cam having John just talk it out. On the other hand, this scene could even be right at the beginning of the show. 2x07 leaves off with John storming to his room after that bit of emo fallout. 2x08 could pickup right from that point, cutting to evening /night, and John skipping supper, Cam checks in on him, John tells Cam to leave him alone, but Cam stubbornly persists and stays, and John gives up with a flabergasted sigh. Cameron takes initiative, goes to his bed, lays down beside him, starts talking about the future, while John just lays there listning until he opens up a little (comes around to being talkative). I don't think this would weigh as much or have as much impact as per say happening at the end of the episode for given said events. But it'd still mean something - considering Cameron snitched on John about Riley's visit from last night and John messing up by forgetting to re-arm the alarm. Neither John or Cameron are saints, both have screwed up in their fair share of times sofar in season 2. And its caused a rift between them. Its counterproductive to Cameron's mission of protection, and we're also see'ing a 3-way rift here with Sarah also in the mix. Such a scene like this could make things worse between Sarah and John, or it could have a positive effect on John, help bring him back down to Earth, and in side effect, also begin mending the mother-son rift thats forming.
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Post by chrisimo on Nov 8, 2008 5:47:53 GMT -5
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t101
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Post by t101 on Nov 8, 2008 6:24:56 GMT -5
Woah. I actually thought John's trip to Mexico wasn't going to be another fit of stupidity.
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Post by chrisimo on Nov 8, 2008 6:29:02 GMT -5
Woah. I actually thought John's trip to Mexico wasn't going to be another fit of stupidity. Yeah, me too. I guess there needs to be a real bad event for John to adjust his personality. Maybe this will happen in this episode.
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terrasj
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Post by terrasj on Nov 8, 2008 6:34:05 GMT -5
Awesome find man! Still doesn't reveal much, though it might look like its towards the end of the episode, after all the stuff that happened... Ya think Sarah really throws the towel at John this time? As in "Your grounded young man...!" ? The effort towards trying to have a reasonable talk can be a good thing for the long run. And we get to find out a bit more what happens - why John goes to Mexico and the trouble he gets into. All thanks to Riley....
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t101
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Post by t101 on Nov 8, 2008 6:41:28 GMT -5
I'm now almost convinced the scene with Cameron happens somewhere at the beginning and serves as foreshadowing for the disaster to follow. Hopefully at least this time the moral gets drilled into his head.
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Post by chrisimo on Nov 8, 2008 7:28:54 GMT -5
And we get to find out a bit more what happens - why John goes to Mexico and the trouble he gets into. All thanks to Riley.... Hmm, I don't think it's Riley's fault. He wants to have a normal life and Riley is his chance to have that. I think that the events that happen as a result of his relationship with her will make him realize that he has to accept certain things about his life. Without her, this perhaps wouldn't happen. I think she is needed as a catalyst for a change within himself.
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tom
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Post by tom on Nov 8, 2008 9:16:37 GMT -5
And we get to find out a bit more what happens - why John goes to Mexico and the trouble he gets into. All thanks to Riley.... Hmm, I don't think it's Riley's fault. He wants to have a normal life and Riley is his chance to have that. I think that the events that happen as a result of his relationship with her will make him realize that he has to accept certain things about his life. Without her, this perhaps wouldn't happen. I think she is needed as a catalyst for a change within himself. I think the same. Perhaps he's going to realize he can't have a relationship (not yet) without risking her and his own life. So, maybe the episode ends John sending Riley away, far from him and the danger. And maybe this makes him want to not to feel anything at all.
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Post by Deep Art Frummy on Nov 8, 2008 12:10:50 GMT -5
Hmm, this episode looks promising. John finally using a shotgun, word.
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Post by vicheron on Nov 8, 2008 21:19:51 GMT -5
Does Riley even have parents? The way that she just shows up and spends hours at a time with John seems a bit too convenient and very suspicious.
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Post by terrasj on Nov 9, 2008 0:29:17 GMT -5
Hmm, I don't think it's Riley's fault. He wants to have a normal life and Riley is his chance to have that. I think that the events that happen as a result of his relationship with her will make him realize that he has to accept certain things about his life. Without her, this perhaps wouldn't happen. I think she is needed as a catalyst for a change within himself. I think the same. Perhaps he's going to realize he can't have a relationship (not yet) without risking her and his own life. So, maybe the episode ends John sending Riley away, far from him and the danger. And maybe this makes him want to not to feel anything at all. Yeah, and so which way does John turn to after? Turns inwards and becomes self-reclusive? Or does he gravitate and opens up towards Cameron? Is that why she becomes his sole personal friend and confidant in the future? Because John had nobody else he felt he could turn to? Does Riley even have parents? The way that she just shows up and spends hours at a time with John seems a bit too convenient and very suspicious. Foster child perhaps? Foster Parents - ones that can't control her or possibly ones that don't seem to care about her 'out-going' and 'staying out late' nature? How interesting that'd be, mirroring the younger John Connor from T2... She could have real parents, career type parents that are barely ever home enough to properly look after her, so she's got free reign on what she wants to do, when she wants and go where she wants? She's dressed well enough, but doesn't seem to have the cash to flaunt around, bringing her the rare type thats personable and down to earth in attitude.
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tom
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Post by tom on Nov 9, 2008 18:07:15 GMT -5
My guess is he's going to turn inwards at first surely, cause it's a natural (and first) human reaction. Then probably he'll be angry at the world for a while and will sleep with 9mm under his pillow. And if he realizes he can't do anything and has no one to open up, I would understand him if he chooses Cameron as a talk-to-buddy. Not of course as a friend, but more like a pet. Sounds funny; a killing machine as a pet- like sleeping with a chainsaw but it's the same reason why people share their most personal problems and secrets with their dogs. Cameron (just as pets) can't understand John's feelings and won't use them against him later. Also John wouldn't feel so inconvenient or exposed and Cam wouldn't think John is weak or a softie. And Cam doesn't have to understand or react to John, most of the time it's enough if she just listens- that's what Sigmund Freud did. So it totally makes sense to me to choose Cameron over humans as a "friend". I would go with the foster child idea. Kinda schematic but works well, especially if it would in fact mirror the T2 john. ;D
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